Please consider registering
guest

Log In Register

Register | Lost password?
Advanced Search

— Forum Scope —

  

— Match —

   

— Forum Options —

   

Minimum search word length is 4 characters - maximum search word length is 84 characters

Topic RSS
a correction to your website
March 11, 2004
1:10 pm
dean
United Kingdom
Member
Forum Posts: 7
Member Since:
October 14, 2003
Offline

I have not been to this site for quite a while as i find shopping with elswhere a lot easier in terms of range and availability (and now honesty). But I had a look here to see if anythings new (no) and saw that you state that you have the widest range of fine blend and origin chocolate online - I beg to differ as I see Chocolate Trading Company has a lot more of these brands and as you are nearly always sold out of most of your line I find your claim quite misleading. I see you have a link to chocolate Trading Company in your sources section so I suggest you take a look.

In fact, I see quite a few misleading statements on your website that really is quite naughty. Like chocolate is healthy - yes it can be "healthier" if its not crammed packed full of sugar and compared to a mars bar but is it fair to sell it as healthy? I think this is stretching it a bit too far and quite irresponsible.

And finally the last and most misleading thing that a friend pointed out to me is that you claim next day delivery is £4.95 when in fact further down the order route it turns into £5.50!

This all of course led to our conclusion that we do not want to give you money if your trying to take it from us by misleading us. I wonder if when people do order they actually get the delivery when stated , or is this a misrepresentation also?

I have never written a letter of complaint in my life but with so many cons going around, particularly on the web, I feel I should stand up and let you know what I, a possible customer, think. I will come back when I have more time and I expect to see all these inaccuracies corrected. If not I will take this further - its not fair.

March 15, 2004
7:58 pm
Lone Ly
Oslo, Norway
Member
Forum Posts: 397
Member Since:
October 10, 2003
Offline

quote:


Originally posted by deanIn fact, I see quite a few misleading statements on your website that really is quite naughty. Like chocolate is healthy - yes it can be "healthier" if its not crammed packed full of sugar and compared to a mars bar but is it fair to sell it as healthy? I think this is stretching it a bit too far and quite irresponsible.

And finally the last and most misleading thing that a friend pointed out to me is that you claim next day delivery is £4.95 when in fact further down the order route it turns into £5.50!

This all of course led to our conclusion that we do not want to give you money if your trying to take it from us by misleading us. I wonder if when people do order they actually get the delivery when stated , or is this a misrepresentation also?


To me it seems like you are taking things a bit too far. First and foremost, I consider it common sense that sugar and stuff is not healthy. When chocolate is referred to as healthy, it is because there are healthy ingredients (cocoa) - and the higher cocoa percentage the healthier is the chocolate. I can't see any irresponsible about this statement.

According to delivery I can only speak for myself. I was asked in an e-mail to confirm delivery charges and informed when outsold goods where expected back in stock. Furthermore, since I preferred to recieve one package I was allowed to change my order. The whole lot arrived as expected.

So, according to my experience there are no misleadings. As for the expected claim due £ 4.95 which turned out to be a bit more, you were at least informed about the real amount before signing up for anything.

"Man cannot live by chocolate alone - but woman can." (Unknown)
March 17, 2004
10:32 pm
theobroma
MIlwaukee, USA
Member
Forum Posts: 89
Member Since:
September 7, 2003
Offline

Hi
I understand that Dean may have been in a bad mood when he wrote his diatribe, but I'm a responsible e-community member, so I'll gladly respond to his post. Please be aware that I am not a 70% employee, and Martin doesn't owe me any favors...
1. Yes, the Chocolate Trading Company does have a wider selection, though it is a selection without great attention to quality. Most of the chocolates they offer are decent, but there's no emphasis on the best, as there is here. Also, I like to be able to check the review and forum sections here before buying. Lastly, I have ordered from the Chocolate Trading Co, and my order was shipped missing three bars.
2. The idea of 'health' is a widely contested one, and it's a major endeavor to take any well-researched stance on the 'health value' of chocolate. Historically, in south and central America, chocolate was not mixed with sugar, and only occasionally with honey. It was understood to be a very healthy thing, providing an increase in energy and alertness (caffeine, methylxanthine, phenylthylamine), and a general feeling of well-being (from a host of micro-chemicals that are now being researched). So, mental health is an important element to consider when assessing the health value of chocolate.
The Spanish, and subsequent european chocophiles, added sugar to make the cocoa more suitable to their palattes. One thing we know about health is that an excess of a particular substance, without making use of it, is unhealthy. Ie, too many simple sugars with not enough exercise will lead to obesity. Duh.
Furthermore, good dark chocolate contains a relatively high level of anti-oxidants.
Check out this link: http://www.domori.com
Go to the 'function and food' section. Read.

Lastly, the Chocolate Trading Co may be a good business, but their primary goal is to SELL STUFF TO YOU. Here, I feel that the sharing of chocolate-related information is the focus, while the opportunity to buy chocolate is both a service to us and a way to make this site possible. Notice there are no advertisements...

Best wishes, and good luck

Kyle

Oh no! My Augustus!

Oh no! My Agustus!
March 19, 2004
4:42 pm
dean
United Kingdom
Member
Forum Posts: 7
Member Since:
October 14, 2003
Offline

Interesting comments but I wanted to make some important points and have it addressed responsibly - which I see has not happened as yet....

The delivery cost is misleading, there is no doubt about that. I think it weak to argue at least your told later on? And of course chocolate is not healthy as it is blatantly sold here, I dont care what history or chemical knowledge is banded about. Is red wine sold as healthy? I think not, and that has high levels of antioxidents.

And no I have neither the inclination nor the time to promote Chocolate Trading Company - I think they do it clearley themselves. Yes of course they want to sell you chocolate - chocolate from the most premium brands to the more affordable high quality brands. Not everyone can afford the so called "best" and isn't the "best" chocolate the one you like the most?

Anyway, if anyone is promoting someone here I suspect the owners do it themselves in their own forum - pretty obvious really and I think people with half a brain realise that. Duh.

Anyway cant stay chatting here (or retaliating bitchy comments) - got a life!

March 20, 2004
12:29 am
theobroma
MIlwaukee, USA
Member
Forum Posts: 89
Member Since:
September 7, 2003
Offline

Hi Dean
Sitting at a computer is not so healthy, neither is looking at a screen, neither is driving, or being out in sunlight without the proper protection, nor is breathing the air in a metropolitan area, nor is living in a country that has done nuclear weapons testing within its boundaries, nor is eating apple skins (arsenic), or most commonly available produce (pesticides), or most milk (growth hormones), or most meat (same problem, and on and on and on.
It is a fact that humans need simple sugars to live. It is up to the individual to monitor his intake of simple sugars. The body also uses lipids, or fats. The fats present in cocoa butter happen to be among the healthier ones. And, though I am not an expert on it, there has been significant and reliable research supporting the idea that cocoa contains a host of chemicals that aid in mental health.
So, to each his own.
The cocoa industry, if managed correctly, will be one of the key industries involved in saving the rainforests, as theobroma cacao thrives only in rainforest conditions. So, directly or indirectly, chocolate may be involved in the promotion of earth stewardship, which is essential for the health of all organisms on the planet.

Nonetheless, don't take my word for it. Do your own research, and consult your physician before even touching chocolate again.
Shipping I have no opinion on, as I am not even a resident of the UK. However, when it comes to health, it is and always will be a personal discretion.
Best of luck
Kyle

Oh no! My Agustus!

Oh no! My Agustus!
March 20, 2004
2:07 pm
bobvilax2000
Seville, USA
Member
Forum Posts: 128
Member Since:
July 26, 2003
Offline

Yes the only fuel that the human brain can survuve on is glucose, simple sugars, but your body does not require the intake of any sugar. The glucose that feeds your brain and central nervous system comes from the break down of carbohydrates. If your body does not get enough of carbohydrates, like the people on the atkin's diet, your body will break down your muscle into glucose to feed your brain... Sorry, just a side note.

I think that a lot of these claims are stretching the health benefits of chocolate. I have no way to prove it, though, so I won't go making claims. A lot of the research is funded by Mars Inc...

March 21, 2004
1:48 am
theobroma
MIlwaukee, USA
Member
Forum Posts: 89
Member Since:
September 7, 2003
Offline

Good point. The body can break down complex carbohydrates into sugars, and the energy source most used by the body is a molecule called ATP, which it can manufacture from various things.
My point, overall, is that life is unhealthy, and eventually leads to death. Even entropy will eventually get you, as your own dna replication for creating new cells will sooner or later be bogged down with enough errors that your major organs start to go. So, while we are alive, we might as well LIVE. Enjoy the diversity of life and experience available to us. If that means eating chocolate, the important part being the cocoa, then so be it. If someone feels that simple sugars are a detriment to ones health, (s)he can eat sugar free bars, with stevia for example. Whatever.
If anyone can show real evidence that chocolate is unhealthy, I'll be interested to look into it.
Otherwise, I apologize for getting a wee bit negative on a public forum, and wish Dean and those concerned about 'naughtiness' well.
Ciao
Kyle

Oh no! My Agustus!

Oh no! My Agustus!
March 21, 2004
2:38 am
bobvilax2000
Seville, USA
Member
Forum Posts: 128
Member Since:
July 26, 2003
Offline

Everything in the world is good for you in moderation. If you love cheesecake, it's good for you, but not everyday. You'll have a heart attack. There are few things in the world that I don't like, both healthy and unhealthy, I've just learned to limit the things that may cause an artery blockage before I'm thirty.

April 18, 2004
11:40 pm
Lone Ly
Oslo, Norway
Member
Forum Posts: 397
Member Since:
October 10, 2003
Offline

I couldn't agree more with the points you guys have made on health. And I stick to my own excuse that eating chocolate with high cocoa percentage and few artificial additives is much more healthy than other sorts of chocolates like milk chocolate. In fact I am myself an example of the healthy effects of chocolate. Some weeks ago I discovered that if I don't eat chocolate at least four times a week, my nose get blocked! Sounds weird, but true. (Theobroma, you might call it "evidence" if you like. Three days off chocolate and I sound like allergic.) I am of course aware that there no general conclusion can be drawn from this.

As for the misleading delivery fees I still can't see why there is a problem as long as you're informed in advance and no one force you to accept the "other" fee if you don't want. If you'd been charged higher in aftermath, I'd understand the complaint.

Dean wrote: "Anyway, if anyone is promoting someone here I suspect the owners do it themselves in their own forum - pretty obvious really and I think people with half a brain realise that. Duh." I thought the forum was open for anyone. The only owner-like person I've seen is Martin. But it might very well be that I haven't even got half a brain.

"Man cannot live by chocolate alone - but woman can." (Unknown)
May 13, 2004
1:28 am
Martin Christy
London, United Kingdom
Member
Forum Posts: 614
Member Since:
July 31, 2006
Offline
10

Hi Dean,

Great to see someone from Chocolate Trading Company participating on the forum!

We are first and foremost here to promote fine chocolate, especially in the UK. We are a retail outlet second and not a dedicated retailer like yourselves, so our shop may not always be up to your standards.

We want to see good chocolate available to all, which is why we have recommended your site from the very beginning. Indeed, I have personally ordered from you and been impressed by your service in the past.

We really hope that all those who want to see the quality of chocolate improve in the UK can get together and promote the cause in a constructive way. Fine chocolate is a wide-open and exciting venture, with many new and fast moving developments, but still many people have no idea of its existence. We’re sure there is room for many players in this market, and at this early stage we feel mutual support is the most constructive way forward.

I do note that you have not actually ordered from our shop, so I am not sure exactly what you are complaining about and how you could take this further, but anyway, thanks for pointing out the error, which has now been corrected.

The only health statements we make are about FINE chocolate, i.e. with less sugar and all natural ingredients, and no added fat other than cocoa butter. The health benefits here are well documented, for instance at http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/hea.....185363.stm .

Martin Christy
Editor
http://www.seventypercent.com

Martin Christy Editor www.seventypercent.com
May 19, 2004
10:24 pm
Martin Christy
London, United Kingdom
Member
Forum Posts: 614
Member Since:
July 31, 2006
Offline
11

Chocolate Trading Company have kindly been in touch to tell us that Dean is not an employee of Chocolate Trading or in any way connected with them, so apologies to Chocolate Trading and to Dean for any misunderstanding if this is the case.

We welcome input from all parties, from the chocolate trade and from the public, and we encourage debate in the forum, even if this is at our own expense - we are not perfect and we don't mind to hear it or discuss it in the open.

I really don't want to see the forum become a place for grievances and personal agendas, but we do understand that readers or customers may sometimes want to share their opinions about us in the forum. So we've added a new feedback area of the forum and I've moved this whole topic into it, to keep this separate from the good, healthy, chocolate debate going on elsewhere.

Cheers.

Martin Christy
Editor
http://www.seventypercent.com

Martin Christy Editor www.seventypercent.com

a correction to your website | Website Feedback and comments | Forum